When you tell Daniel Vettori that he is a quintessential nice guy of cricket, he gives you an embarrassed smile. Soon, it turns into a cheeky grin when he tries to convince you that he is not all that nice after all and that his impeccable moral image is the one he has portrayed to the public. It is hard to believe but you smile and move on.

Vettori played for New Zealand for so long that it is hard to remember a Black Caps team without a bespectacled left-arm spinner operating tirelessly from one end as the fast bowlers keep changing from the other. He has played so many roles for them over the years that determining which aspect of the man the team will miss the most is not easy.

There are of course, 705 international wickets and 6989 runs, but Vettori’s worth to New Zealand cricket goes much beyond that. He has now called time on his playing career and taken up coaching. He has been with the Royal Challengers Bangalore for a while and now Vettori has signed a contract with Brisbane Heat in the Big Bash League.

In a chat with iplt20.com, RCB’s head coach reflects on his cricketing journey and his transition from playing to mentoring.

You spent half your life playing for New Zealand. How different is life now?

It is very similar. I’ve stepped right back into the touring schedule, so it is pretty much the same as of now. You associate your life with being on tour whether as a player or a coach. And it is pretty much the same.

New Zealand is not a country where spin bowlers develop and thrive. How was it growing up as a spinner in such a country?

I think being a spin bowler in New Zealand you are lucky to get the opportunities early because there are not many of them. You learn most of your craft whist you’re playing. You straight away get into the mix of things at the top level and develop along the way. There are benefits to it.

You have carried New Zealand cricket on your shoulders for so long but never made it about yourself. You didn’t announce your Test retirement because you thought it wouldn’t be appropriate given what happened with Phil Hughes. You went away from ODIs without any farewell. Is this just the reflection of who you are as a person?

It is probably the New Zealand way. Most of us are self deprecating and don’t like to put ourselves there too much. It has certainly been the New Zealand team’s philosophy since Brendon (McCullum) and Michael (Hesson) have been at the helm – try to put the team first as much as possible. I think the guys have really taken it on board. We do enjoy our individual success but at the same time, never really make it all about ourselves.

The ability to deceive the batsman with your guile and playing those subtle mind games is a big part of spin bowling. Did you put a lot of emphasis on that as a spinner?

I wouldn’t say I played mind games but you’re right in that you always have to out-think the batsman or at least have an understanding of what he is trying to do. Most good spin bowlers around the world are generally one step ahead of the batsman. I think playing T20 and one-day cricket helps because you get to understand when a batsman is trying to be aggressive. There are still many exceptional batsmen around, the wickets are flat and grounds as small. These are challenging times for spinners and tough formats. But that also forces you to come up with new ways to go one-up against them and you develop that ability with experience. The spinners that stand out are the ones who develop these qualities.

As a spinner what made you feel like the batsman is ahead of you?

Being aggressive. If a batsman is being aggressive towards you it definitely puts you on the backfoot. When a guy takes you on continuously, you don’t know how to come back from that assault. So, the most aggressive batsmen are the ones toughest to bowl to.

Could you name one batsman in your Test career you really enjoyed your battles with?

In Test cricket it has to be Rahul Dravid. I think he was an exceptional player of spin bowling due to his ability to read lengths. That is the toughest batsman to bowl to – someone who can pick that length early and get back and then forward when they have to. I never felt like I bowled a ball that really troubled Rahul. You feel pretty paralysed.

You have seen the game grow and evolve over the years. How would you assess the current state of spin bowling as opposed to say a decade ago?

If you look at the recent World Cup, there were a few guys who really stood up – Imran Tahir and R Ashwin in particular. I think if a spinner can succeed in New Zealand on those small grounds and even in Australia, it shows that you are able to perform various roles at the international level. Obviously spin bowling has changed a bit with more stringent guidelines regarding the elbow flex and it has taken a couple of spinners out of the picture. But the success of Ashwin shows that traditional spin bowlers can be incredibly successful.

Is Ashwin someone who excites you in particular?

Yes, he has been around for a long time and been successful. He is one guy who is always developing himself and updating his game to go with the new challenges. That is a sign that he is an exceptional spin bowler.

Talking about captaincy, is it a little tough being a bowling captain since you have to simultaneously think about your own bowling plans and those of the team?

It is not that bad actually. It keeps you in the game and as a captain you don’t want to let the game drift. If you are a part of that process of controlling and changing the game with your own bowling, it works to your advantage. You are not just making the bowling changes and setting the fields but also contributing towards the run of play with your own bowling. Most of the times that was enjoyable; but sometimes when you bowl 30-40 overs it can be difficult to keep that focus going.

You have time and again spoken about your quest of becoming better as a batsman. Do your batting achievements give you more satisfaction given that you have had to work hard on it and improve gradually?

I think so, yes. That is something I am most proud of in my cricketing career. I started my Test career at No. 11 and being able to gradually improve my batting, score a Test century and be considered an all-rounder was very satisfying.

Daniel Vettori is the quintessential nice guy of cricket. How is it possible to spend 18 years playing top-level sport without any slip-up?

Oh, there have been plenty of slip-ups, I’ll tell you that. I think the people who know me, know that I am not quite the person I project to be in public and in the media. But it is a persona that seems to work better than putting yourself out there. That’s the way I have spent my career and it has worked for me.

The phrase, ‘Spirit of Cricket’ is used time and again in many contexts. You are someone who has lived that phrase throughout your career. Has it been a conscious effort or you’ve just been yourself?

There was a bit of me in there but you also learn from people along the way. Stephen Fleming was New Zealand’s captain for a long time and I learned so much from him including the spirit with which he played and led the New Zealand team. Brendon McCullum plays the game that way, whether as a captain or a player. Whatever the environment is around you, you tend to draw from it and it shows in your actions. Your own set of principles also steer you towards that direction, and I think that is what has happened most of the time with me. If you look at incidents over the years, they have been group decisions rather than individual decisions. It is because we, as a team, thought that we have to do the right thing here.

You are a bit of a trendsetter in that you began your coaching career when you were still playing for your country. Is changing the mindset from being a player to a coach frequently difficult?

It hasn’t been difficult as such. There is obviously a lot of work that goes into coaching in the background. It doesn’t have that physical nature of when you’re playing but there is a lot of organizing, man-management and keeping the guys informed of their roles. These things take up most of the time.

You have been with RCB for a while now and recently signed up with Brisbane Heat. Can we expect to see you coaching a first-class or an international team in the near future?

I just stumbled upon coaching; it wasn’t a role that projected in at the latter stages of my career. But opportunities like this with RCB and Brisbane are few and far between. With these two roles, it was only after the offers that I really wanted to do it. But whether that transitions into a full-time role is difficult to say.

Is there any coach, from your career as a player, from whose book of coaching you’d like to take a leaf?

I have really enjoyed working with Mike Hesson over the last few years. He is someone who likes to work in the background and make sure that things are all set up for the players so that there are no false steps. A lot can be made of giving those motivational speeches to the team and those pep-talks in the team meetings. But the most important thing is to let the players know in which direction they are going and what is required off them. Mike has been brilliant in that over the last four years. Every player in the New Zealand team understands his role and place in the team.

As a coach do you lean more on the technical side or man-management side?

I think a bit on the management side and more on the game sense. If I can help the young spinners in the squad in terms of their technique and understanding of their game, it gives me a lot of satisfaction. With the batting, I wouldn’t go and tell someone like an AB de Villiers that his backfoot is not quite right. I wouldn’t presume to know better than these guys. I’d rather look to contribute in my specialty area and then get involved in man management in and around the group.